Love u Miss u Bye
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Love u Miss u Bye
The Menedez Family Secrets
Could a chilling family yacht trip have foreshadowed one of the most notorious crimes in U.S. history? Join me, Christi Chanelle, on this gripping episode of the "Love U Miss, U Buy" podcast, where we unravel the disturbing narrative of the Menendez Brothers, Lyle and Erik, and delve into the tragic events of August 20, 1989. Through Eric's eyes, we explore the eerie lead-up to the murder of their parents, Jose and Kitty Menendez, shedding light on the brothers' emotional turmoil and the harrowing allegations of long-standing sexual abuse. This episode not only revisits the pivotal day of the murders but also examines the troubling aftermath and the psychological scars left behind.
Hear the haunting testimonies from family members like their aunt Marta and grandmother Maria, who paint a picture of a deeply troubled household, riddled with allegations of manipulation and cruelty. We confront the stark realities of abuse, discussing the courage needed to face such painful truths and the imperative role we all have in protecting vulnerable children. This episode is a solemn reminder of the collective duty we hold to advocate for those who cannot speak for themselves. Viewer discretion is advised due to the sensitive nature of the content.
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Welcome to part two of the Menendez Brothers series. Instead of starting this episode with a sound clip or footage from the Menendez trial, I've decided to start it with me telling you how uncomfortable this episode will be. I tried to make it as non-graphic as I could, but we are discussing hard, hard topics sexual abuse and murder. I don't know how to tone those two things down. I don't think it's possible, and as I started to edit this episode, I realized I can't mute all of those things in a way that it's pleasant, because it's not. I can't tell you about the murder of Jose and Kitty and not tell you the mindset that Eric and Lyle were in. You have to hear why they felt they had no other choice, and the way to do that is to share, in their own words, the sexual abuse.
Speaker 1:Now, I did not put fully everything that happened because as I was listening to it, I felt nauseous. I felt physically ill listening to this testimony. Ill listening to this testimony and I don't know that the exact details of both brothers are as relevant as the overall picture. So I just did certain clips that weren't as explicit as they could be, but I would like to point out that these are public knowledge and you can pull these clips from court TV and hear the graphic details. I'm not really sure why you'd want to do that. I know that I'm not that person because it's hard to handle.
Speaker 1:It's hard to handle and hearing that I tried to give the story as best I could, but I want you to know this episode is not for people that can't handle that and I know a lot of people already have the background of this story. So this is the heart of this story. Viewer discretion is advised. If you suspect a child of being abused emotionally, physically or sexually, the Child Help National Child Abuse Hotline is 1-800-422-4453. I'm your host, Christy Chanel, and this is the Love you Miss, you Buy podcast. Let's hear from Eric about what it was like the weeks leading up to killing his parents.
Speaker 2:I remember my graduation day pretty clearly. It took place at Beverly Hills High. My mom was there and my dad was there. I was really glad to see my brother. My brother spent most of his time on the East Coast so I was really glad whenever he was out in California and I was able to spend some time with him After graduating, I was really excited. It was one step closer going off to college to be able to get away.
Speaker 1:So, as you can see, that's where Eric's mentality is. On August 19th, kitty and Jose charter a yacht and the whole family, along with crew, go on this yacht together. The witnesses that were there that day say that the whole feeling, the whole energy on the yacht is very off.
Speaker 2:Nothing about that trip made sense. The whole energy on the there, but there wasn't many fishing going on, so it was like there was this pretense we were there for one reason, but we were there really for a whole other reason.
Speaker 3:Basically the deckhand and I did everything. None of the four came back. They really kind of acted like they didn't want to have any part of it the family they were estranged almost the whole time. It was a weird vibe just all around. As they came to the boat and we set sail off the dock, the boys moved up to the bow of the boat and the parents basically went down inside the boat remember a lot of waves and the waves would crash over the boat and the water was cold.
Speaker 3:We actually took a wake over the bow and it got the boys soaked. And the boys just sat there. They didn't bother going back to get a towel or anything to go warm up with and they sat out there in the cold breeze basically almost the whole trip my mom was upset that there were more people on the boat than she anticipated.
Speaker 2:I guess she had only expected the boat captain to be there and I remember thinking why should she care? The idea of being alone on the ocean with nobody around. I was nervous and paranoid, for a good reason. To this day I wonder what was supposed to happen that night. The boat ride just seemed endless and I remember just just right, and so I just huddled up in front of the boat. My brother had a lot of questions. We talked about everything that had been happening, why I had gone through this and not told him. I think Lyle felt really horrible that he had suspected that this was happening because it happened to him and I was trying to convince Lyle that you know there was nothing he could have done, that this wasn't his fault.
Speaker 1:The next day, august 20th 1989, kitty and Jose decided they want to stay in and watch a movie. Eric and Lyle also want to watch a movie, but they're going to actually go to the movie to see batman. On august 20th 1989, jose and kitty were shot to death in their beverly hills home. Jose was shot six times with a shotgun, while kitty suffered 10 gunshot wounds. The crime was so brutal that police initially believed the slayings were a mob hit. Lyle, then 21, called the police to report the murders nearly two hours after they had taken place. Early investigations focused on business rivals and a porn executive who had previously had problems with Jose. Although the brothers were distraught that night, their behavior over the next few months hardly suggested they were in mourning. Let's hear from Lyle and Eric what happened the day of the murders.
Speaker 5:I ran around and shot my mom.
Speaker 6:Where did you shoot her At?
Speaker 5:a street store. I shot her close.
Speaker 7:I was just firing as I went into the room. I just started firing.
Speaker 8:In what direction? In front of me what was in front of you my parents did you love your mom and dad yes and I, august 20th 1989, did you and your brother kill your mother and father what do you believe was the originating cause of you and your brother ultimately winding up shooting your parents?
Speaker 5:Me telling Lyle that uh.
Speaker 8:Okay, it was you telling Lyle what.
Speaker 5:That my dad had been molesting me.
Speaker 9:Why did you kill your parents?
Speaker 5:Because we were afraid.
Speaker 1:On June 28th 1996, barbara Walters had a now notorious interview with Eric and Lyle Menendez. A lot of people assume that he was strictly being abused by his father, sexually abused, and I, being one of these people, did not really understand why they killed the mother, why it didn't make a lot of sense to me. So I'm really glad that she asked this question in this interview. Let's listen to what they say.
Speaker 10:On Thursday night before in one of the explosions explosions I was running downstairs and I was crying and my mother was on the couch. She had been drinking and she said what's wrong with you? And I said nothing, nothing, you wouldn't understand. She said oh, I understand what. Do you think I'm stupid? And and she told me that she knew that she had known all my life what my father was doing and it was like I didn't even know who she was anymore and I just saw dad and mom as the same person at that point. I saw them as a single person.
Speaker 1:Although the brothers were distraught that night, their behavior over the next few months hardly suggested that they were in mourning. They quickly blew through some of the family's fortune, with Lyle buying himself a Rolex watch, a Porsche sports car and even put a $300,000 down payment on a restaurant which he named Mr Buffalo's. The two brothers spent a total of $700,000 in the six months following their parents' death. Let's hear from Lyle as he discusses why and what he bought right after he killed his parents.
Speaker 4:I think it's characterized as a spending spray, because it sort of they condense it into how much money do you spend after your parents died? But at the trial it was very clear that this was a family that sort of just spent money like water before. I had spent a huge amount of money before, as all the family members did. We didn't really think about money. It was a wealthy family that spent money on you know a lot of things. So money corrupts the narrative of it and it just you know there's a sense that, okay, wealth means greed and that must always be the motive for everything, and it's not.
Speaker 1:They planned for that question, which of course they would have, because that's really what drew suspicion spending all that money. Eric also spent money, but not quite as much as Lyle did. He ended up buying a Jeep Wrangler and he bought a professional tennis coach, which was going for about $50,000 a year. So not as much, still a lot. I also have this really whacked out fact While they were out spending money, they also bought front row tickets to the Knicks game and, as fate would have it, there is a Mark Jackson 1990 trading card.
Speaker 1:That happened in that window where they snapped a picture of Mark Jackson. And guess who is in the background on the left of that trading card, sitting front row? Oh yeah, yep, lyle and Eric Menendez. What the hell? First of all, how somebody found that is beyond me, but the fact that it happened is just next level, unbelievable. If you're not watching on YouTube, go Google. Mark Jackson 1990 trading card Lyle and Eric Menendez. It has been proven that they are in fact in his trading card and the value has gone up. I want to read you a little bit about that. One eBay seller is currently seeking $1,500 for their card, while others are auctioning their inventory from anywhere from $8 to $500, depending on the condition. I thought that was a complete trip that this card has them in it. I mean, what are the odds? Yeah, so I had to share that with you because it was crazy.
Speaker 1:After looking into the murders of Kitty and Jose, one of the things that I found extremely interesting was that Kitty was in therapy as well, but there are records that show that Kitty was actually afraid of her two sons. She is recorded as saying they are sociopaths and would sleep with her door locked. That's a big deal. She was afraid of them. Hearing that it's just, it's jarring. So it sounds like Kitty was really dealing with a lot of trauma from her past as she was a child with her family and her present, which was a dominating husband who wanted things a certain way and obviously had his own deep, dark secrets that she also held very close to the vest.
Speaker 1:I don't want to actually get into how graphic this murder scene was, but I can tell you that they were sitting on the couch eating vanilla ice cream, watching a movie. It's very, very graphic. He was not recognizable. Kitty did not die in the first couple of shots and Lyle had to come and finish the job because Eric wasn't able to, and ironically he ended up telling his therapist that he was having repeated dreams of killing his parents and them not dying, and it probably stems from the fact that Kitty did not die right away, so he had to watch her suffer. She was also not recognizable and she was shot in the face at close range, so this was a very horrific scene. They also shot them in the kneecaps, I believe, to make it look like it was a mob hit because Jose had a lot of people that did not like him and they could see that there might be some connections there in the movie business or music business.
Speaker 1:And because of the 911 call, eric is screaming in the background and Lyle is sobbing uncontrollably into the phone. When the police get there, they're asked to come outside. They come outside and Eric hits his head into the tree and then he's in a fetal position on the ground sobbing and Lyle is trying to console him. The police did not even think for a second that they had anything to do with it, based on their sheer, just gut wrenching cries and I believe those were sincere. It was so much emotion from all of the years of abuse and the fact that they had done this to their family. There was a lot it was a clash of all these emotions that were happening and, I'm sure, at some point, relief. Let's talk about what got them to a point where they felt that they had to kill their parents.
Speaker 8:What started happening that led you to believe that?
Speaker 7:He used to come into my room and give me massages.
Speaker 8:Was this the first time your father had ever massaged you in any way?
Speaker 7:No, he would massage my legs, my thighs, my calves to get me ready to go swimming.
Speaker 8:The massages in your room. What types of massages were they in the beginning?
Speaker 7:Just the body massages. He would have me strip off my clothes until I was just wearing my underwear and lie down on my stomach.
Speaker 8:Would he tell you why he was massaging you?
Speaker 7:He would say it's just to relieve the stress, the stress built up because of sports, and I would need to do this to relax.
Speaker 8:Did the massages change in character in any way?
Speaker 7:Yes, he would massage my.
Speaker 8:Was he using his hands?
Speaker 5:Yes, it just started with. After sports practices he would massage me and we would have these talks and he would show me and he would fondle me and he would ask me to do the same with him and I would touch him and we would undress. Where would this take place?
Speaker 9:In my bedroom, and how often would this happen?
Speaker 5:Like two or three times a week.
Speaker 9:And for how long did this happen?
Speaker 5:Not too long, it began to change.
Speaker 9:When did it began to change? When did it?
Speaker 5:begin to change. I'm not sure exactly at what time, but almost close to when I was seven. And how did it change? I just became more involved. What do you mean more involved?
Speaker 2:We would be in the bathroom and have oral sex with him.
Speaker 1:Let's hear from some of the family members that may give us a little bit of insight. This is Marta Jose Menendez's sister.
Speaker 8:She testifies in defense of nephews Lyle and Eric Ken. I want to show you these two photographs and ask if you recognize the people.
Speaker 1:Yes.
Speaker 8:I do. Who's the smaller person? Oh God, that's Eric. And who's the smaller person? Oh God, that's Eric. And who's the larger person?
Speaker 6:My brother Jose.
Speaker 8:And do you recognize?
Speaker 3:All right, have you seen these pictures before?
Speaker 8:No, I have not. Did you see them in a small version?
Speaker 8:I don't recall your next question, please does Eric appear to be between one and two years old in this photograph? Yes, in both of the photographs, yes. Did you ever see your brother have Eric hold on to a bar and lift him with it? Yes, I did see that. And how old was Eric when you saw your brother doing that? In 1972. He was two years old. And would you describe what your brother would do with respect to the baby in the bar? He would just pull it up and hold him up and see how much he could stand without crying, and eventually would the baby start to cry. Yes, and after the baby started to cry, would your brother then put him down?
Speaker 9:He would laugh at him and then put him down and keep on laughing, because he was such a little one.
Speaker 8:He was such a sissy. He just cried for everything. And had you ever seen your brother do the same exercise with Lyle?
Speaker 1:No, I did not. Okay, now we're going to hear from Maria Menendez, the grandmother and Jose's mother. She never really believed that they did it, but when she found out, when she went to court and they walked in and they said that they did it, she always supported them.
Speaker 6:This boy killing father and mother.
Speaker 11:No, no and no. I am here if they need. I defend my children with teeth and hands. Don't care the body, no, nose, teeth, I nose, I nose my children.
Speaker 1:This is Lyle and Eric's attorney speaking about pictures that were found in an envelope. That were nude pictures and she had them, their mother, they had her writing on the envelope and they were found in her dresser.
Speaker 9:Amazing is the fact that these pictures were taken was that these pictures were saved. You will see the envelope that they came in and you will see the negatives and you will see the original small photos and you will see Kitty Menendez's handwriting that was on the envelope these photos were, in which says Eric's birthday, november 1976. She saw these photographs and she kept them.
Speaker 1:Here's their attorney, leslie. Love her. We'll talk about her in a minute, but anyway she's talking about Eric in these pictures, about how old he was. What was going through his mind in these?
Speaker 8:pictures about how old he was, what was going through his mind. Now this is the crime of Eric Menendez, and I cannot show you the crime that Jose Menendez committed on him, but you heard about some of the things that he liked to do to his little boy, and one of them was to stick tacks like this in his thighs and in his butt and to run needles across his penis. Now that's this man, and I don't recall if there are autopsy photographs of this man where you can see his penis. The one that he stuck in this body that Mr Kuriyama tells you is all made up. The proof that it isn't all made up is who Eric wound up being.
Speaker 8:This is a proof sheet of the sequence of the photographs from Eric's sixth birthday party. These photographs were found in this envelope. This envelope has the handwriting of his mother, mary Louise Menendez, and she had a beautiful handwriting. She was a schoolteacher and she wrote Eric's birthday, november 1976, and inside this envelope were the original small prints taken on that roll, from which this is an enlargement, were the original negatives. And so what we did was we had blow-ups made from the original negatives and we had a proof sheet made of the order of the photographs.
Speaker 8:The sequence of the photographs here is a gathering of people, here is Lyle in the bathtub One can assume the morning of the birthday party and here is Eric in bed. Now Eric is in bed when this naked picture of Lyle is being taken. See, here's the next picture on the roll. Now are we supposed to believe that six-year-old Eric, who testified he was not allowed to handle a camera until he was 12 or 13, got out of bed to go take a naked picture of his brother? And they got back into bed so someone could take a picture waking him up? And it isn't until way down here on the roll that the naked picture of Eric shows up, and then a picture of Mrs Menendez's favorite thing, her animal Tristesse.
Speaker 1:This video. I find so absolutely horrific. I had heard a testimony from Eric how he said it was very, very important to have cinnamon. He would put cinnamon in all of his dad's drinks and it was because he wanted the semen to taste better than what it tasted like. And this is Kitty's side of the family discussing lemon and ketchup that Eric had to have.
Speaker 11:Now I remember this time we were in the house and Eric had to have lemon, oh yeah, and he wasn't being a spoiled brat about it or anything.
Speaker 6:He was just desperate. I remember the lemon thing several times, oh yeah, and he would just fall apart. He was just like, oh my God, when we were at my dad's in Texas he had to have the lemon. And my dad made fun of him when he explained why he had to have it. It just, he said it was the same way with ketchup. Yes, Because Eric was made to swallow the semen. He found out that if he used a lot of ketchup or lemons it would make the taste in his mouth go away. That just became a way of life. How vile all this was going on in our lives. We weren't aware of it and Eric never told anybody, Right, I just never, you know now, Well, we don't go, our mind doesn't go that way.
Speaker 6:No, I don't know if they ever would have told me, told anybody what they were enduring. It wasn't a thing that boys wanted to let anybody know that they were having sex with their father.
Speaker 11:No one would ever go down that hall and go in that room and interrupt or see what's going on or anything, including Kitty. They are such good people and they were tortured. Their dad tortured them and their mom might have to run interference or stop anything or defend them. A while back I remember telling Lyle and Eric how horrible I felt that they were in jail and finally Lyle stopped me and said Diane, don't, I'm happier than I've ever been. He feels better living in prison than he did living with his mom and dad. What does that say?
Speaker 1:This is his cousin Andy.
Speaker 8:Were you familiar with a nickname that your cousin Eric used to refer to himself at about this same time?
Speaker 5:Yes, I did.
Speaker 8:And what was that nickname?
Speaker 5:It was Hurt man.
Speaker 8:Now did he express to you, in this last conversation, his desire with respect to these massages with his father, what he wanted?
Speaker 7:What his father wanted, no, what Eric wanted. What Eric wanted.
Speaker 5:Uh, yeah, he told me he wanted him to stop. Uh, I remember that being the last conversation that I remember.
Speaker 1:This is the therapist under oath talking about the mentality age of Lyle at 21, because a lot of people don't understand why they just didn't leave. They were adults, they could just leave, maybe not.
Speaker 9:Is that a mature state of affairs for someone who's 21 years of age? No, he was 21 at the time his parents died. Is that correct?
Speaker 12:Yes.
Speaker 9:Was he mature for a 21-year-old?
Speaker 12:No.
Speaker 9:Was he immature.
Speaker 12:Yes.
Speaker 9:What is your opinion with regard to the existence of psychological maltreatment? Throughout his life, was there psychological maltreatment?
Speaker 12:Yes, there is psychological maltreatment throughout his life. Was there psychological maltreatment? Yes, there is psychological maltreatment throughout his life. For the part of his life that I've come to know and would you characterize it as mild or moderate or severe?
Speaker 9:severe and what is your opinion with regard to the impact of this lifetime of abuse?
Speaker 12:That it would have created a person, that Lyle would have become, a person who did not see resources around him, people that would help him, people that he was truly connected to. That life was a dangerous thing unless you walked a sort of tight wire or rope that had been directed for you, that he didn't have the basic competencies to direct his own life and needed assistance on that, and that he had not been able to match the standards to be the person that was expected of him, of the person who was the most important one in the world and the most powerful one in his world hearing about all the support that they have and that they have had for the last 34, 35 years from their family is bittersweet, because if they had had this support when they saw the things that they saw, all the people that were involved.
Speaker 1:There was one testimony from his uncle, which his cousin, andy, spoke. His dad, which was Jose's brother, spoke and said that he was at a birthday party at the Menendez house and he saw his brother, jose, whisper something into a five-year-old Lyle's ear and after he did that he peed himself. Jose grabbed him, walked him upstairs to his room and his brother followed to see what was going on. He saw him punch him in the stomach and grab him by the throat and he said you can't do that, stop doing that. And his brother said you cannot tell me what to do. Do that, stop doing that. And his brother said you cannot tell me what to do. This is my house, you can leave. His brother left and never saw them again. Lyle said that was the first time he had seen his uncle since that day, at five years old, testifying at this murder trial. How do you walk away knowing there's abuse? If there wasn't, why did he follow him and tell him to stop. Could he have possibly thought that would be the only time? And if he could do it that blatantly in front of somebody, imagine what he's doing when he's not there. Their own mother knew. She knew. The amount of abuse that they both suffered is beyond comprehension. In summary, after you've heard all of the testimony and conversations with their family, if you're feeling as upset and pissed off as I am. As a parent, my job is to protect my children and you bet your ass. If I ever heard anyone was hurting them, they would not be in my life and they would be in jail if it was possible.
Speaker 1:I know not everybody can get a conviction. I get that. I myself was sexually molested, so I understand how difficult it is. I chose as a nine-year-old not to pursue it. I didn't want to go in front of the court and tell them my testimony. I didn't want to talk about it. I wanted to let it go and be done with it, and my parents gave me a choice. But they actually went in front of all of these people and had to talk about their deepest, darkest shame.
Speaker 1:I hope that today, with the therapy and the people that they've talked to, that they realize there is no shame. This was not their fault. They were children, but it's still a human emotion and because they loved their dad, they thought the time that they were getting with him was valuable, even if it was wrong. They just knew that their dad was showing them attention and love, when outside that bedroom he was not. I'm really ashamed of the family members and I hope, by hearing this, that if you suspect or know that this could be possibly happening to a child, even if it's not sexual abuse but it's mental abuse or it's physical abuse, all of it is abuse and if you suspect it's happening and you don't speak up, you are just as bad. Use your voice. When the child doesn't have their own voice, it's up to us as the adults to use our voice for them To report a possible abuse. Please visit victimconnectorg. See you in part three of the Menendez series. Love you, miss you, bye.
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